Please check this for me.

[Clintster]

I think I've made my decision, sadly I am scared to post it here to get opinions as I'm scared of getting slated for not taking the advice of others. I do appreciate the advice given but ultimately it needs to be my choice so I've taken everything on board and made my choice. I would appreciate it if someone would look over it and see if I've made any glaring mistakes please. It won't be used for gaming, It will be used for heavy AI work including lora training.
Many thanks.
Case
CORSAIR 3000D AIRFLOW MID TOWER GAMING CASE
Processor (CPU)
AMD Ryzen 9 9950X3D 16 Core CPU (4.3GHz-5.7GHz/128MB w/3D V-CACHE/AM5)
Motherboard
GIGABYTE B850 AORUS ELITE WIFI 7 (AM5, DDR5, M.2 PCIe 5.0, Wi-Fi 7)
Memory (RAM)
192GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR5 5200MHz CL38 (4 x 48GB)
Graphics Card
20GB PNY NVIDIA RTX 4000 ADA GENERATION, 6144 CUDA CORES 4 x DP
1st M.2 SSD Drive
1TB CRUCIAL T500 GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 7300MB/sR, 6800MB/sW)
1st M.2 SSD Drive
1TB CRUCIAL T500 GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 7300MB/sR, 6800MB/sW)
Power Supply
CORSAIR 750W RMe SERIES™ ATX 3.1, MODULAR, CYBENETICS GOLD
Power Cable
1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)
Processor Cooling
PCS FrostFlow 200 Series High Performance CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
ONBOARD 2.5Gbe LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
NONE OR ONBOARD Wi-Fi (MOTHERBOARD DEPENDENT)
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 11 Professional 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Windows Recovery Media
Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)
Anti-Virus
NO ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE
Browser
Microsoft® Edge
Warranty
3 Year Platinum Warranty (3 Year Collect & Return, 3 Year Parts, 3 Year labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 6 to 8 working days
Price: £0.00 including VAT and Delivery
Unique URL to re-configure: https://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/saved-configurations/amd-am5-pc/t6M00ENuv6/

Anything you'd improve bearing in mind I want to stay loosely around that price, is the case good enough?

 

[TonyCarter]

Clintster, I’ve not been commenting on the specific components much as I don’t understand your specific needs, so I’ve just been commenting on where a component seems unbalanced for the rest of the system…such as poor quality case, cooler, etc.

But it seems there’s lots of advice being offered, and then your config flips around to something different than we’ve suggested after speaking to the sales people at PCS.

So, is your workload CPU-bound or GPU-bound?

If the former and your current CPU is maxed out, then the 9950X may be the best CPU option (the X3D version is only useful for games, or some applications on Linux that can take advantage of it)…and will trim £200 to be used elsewhere (case & cooler would be my steer).

If your CPU is always sitting at 10-20% with this workload then I’d say it’s the GPU you need to concentrate on, as the CPU is simply shuttling data to the GPU to do the work, and the model/size/trainer will define how much RAM / VRAM / CUDA / Tensor cores are required. But by going for a non-professional GPU you’ll get more performance for the money (at the small risk of needing a new GPU due to the well-publicised power cable/socket issues).

From my understanding of LoRA, the VRAM/GPU is much more important than the CPU and system RAM…so can you clarify?

 

[Clintster]

Clintster, I’ve not been commenting on the specific components much as I don’t understand your specific needs, so I’ve just been commenting on where a component seems unbalanced for the rest of the system…such as poor quality case, cooler, etc.

But it seems there’s lots of advice being offered, and then your config flips around to something different than we’ve suggested after speaking to the sales people at PCS.

So, is your workload CPU-bound or GPU-bound?

If the former and your current CPU is maxed out, then the 9950X may be the best CPU option (the X3D version is only useful for games, or some applications on Linux that can take advantage of it)…and will trim £200 to be used elsewhere (case & cooler would be my steer).

If your CPU is always sitting at 10-20% with this workload then I’d say it’s the GPU you need to concentrate on, as the CPU is simply shuttling data to the GPU to do the work, and the model/size/trainer will define how much RAM / VRAM / CUDA / Tensor cores are required. But by going for a non-professional GPU you’ll get more performance for the money (at the small risk of needing a new GPU due to the well-publicised power cable/socket issues).

From my understanding of LoRA, the VRAM/GPU is much more important than the CPU and system RAM…so can you clarify?

I have not ventured into the AI yet so this in a completely new venture for me so I'm only going by what I have read and been advised.
I believe you are correct that the vram is the most important which is why I originally tried to get the max I could in the 5090, however, since changing my spec to a desktop i have also changed to the RTX4000 although it has a lower vram I understand it still performs well and doesn't have the power cable overheating issues of the 5090, I would like to go with a card with more vram but I think they are out of my reach. therefore my current CPU is not maxed out because there isn't one as I've not started yet. It will all be windows based.
Thanks for your suggestion about not needing the x3d version of the CPU, I will have a look because the saving here might let me gain something on a better GPU although I still think anything greater than 20gbvram might be out of my reach so I suspect case and cooler will be the upgrade, what do you suggest for case and cooler, I don't want/need RGB lights etc and I don't want water cooling, that's all I know though so I thank you for any advice.
I admit my specs have been all over the place but that is because I have no idea what I need so I'm as in the dark as you are.

 

[TonyCarter]

The AIO coolers are not water, they're a non-conductive liquid. Unfortunately none of the PCS-branded air-coolers are worthwhile (and their liquid coolers are worse - as more to go wrong). But for that level of CPU, you'll need a liquid cooler anyway (or a very good air-cooler sourced elsewhere).

For a non-blingy case (although you can turn off the RGB anyway), you've got the Fractal Define 7 or its big brother the Fractal Define 7 XL (which is popular for quiet builds in the creative industry)...

PCSpecialist - FRACTAL DEFINE 7 BLACK QUIET MID-TOWER CASE

PCSpecialist - FRACTAL DEFINE 7 XL BLACK QUIET TOWER CASE

...or the Fractal North...which has better airflow and non-RGB fans on the front...

PCSpecialist - FRACTAL NORTH TG XL GAMING CASE (BLACK)

 

[Scott]

I admit my specs have been all over the place but that is because I have no idea what I need so I'm as in the dark as you are.

I just want to point out that you may be feeling frustration from others as you state that you don't know what you're selecting or why, it always seems random from my standpoint and yet you also state the following:

I think I've made my decision, sadly I am scared to post it here to get opinions as I'm scared of getting slated for not taking the advice of others. I do appreciate the advice given but ultimately it needs to be my choice so I've taken everything on board and made my choice.

There hasn't been a coherent spec posted from you that I've seen yet. Everything seems wildly swinging from left to right when you get an idea or here a new whisper from someone else.

So.... back to basics. All you need to provide is the budget, uses and faith. As you aren't gaming the monitor situation is less important. I think having a power desktop with a low end laptop is an ideal solution.

With your presented uses you will want a high end CPU, a high end GPU and a good amount of RAM. I think 96GB of RAM would be the ideal solution to be honest. Increasing the RAM to 4 slots halves the throughput of the RAM itself, it's an uneven tradeoff for me. For the GPU, if you're really fearful of the overheating connector then the 5080 is going to be the next best offering. Unfortunately it's only 16GB of vRAM. I would stand by the warranty from PCS and the responsibility lying with them so I would have no qualms opting for the 5090 personally. I would just keep an eye from time to time to make sure nothing untoward was happening at the GPU end.

 

[Scott]

So.... here is the ultimate build. It's the best, simple as that. There isn't a better option for any use outside of a proper workstation (threadripper).

Case
FRACTAL NORTH TG XL GAMING CASE (BLACK)
Processor (CPU)
AMD Ryzen 9 9950X 16 Core CPU (4.3GHz-5.7GHz/80MB CACHE/AM5)
Motherboard
GIGABYTE X870E AORUS ELITE WIFI7 (AM5, DDR5, M.2 PCIe 5.0, Wi-Fi 7)
Memory (RAM)
96GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR5 5200MHz CL38 (2 x 48GB) KIT
Graphics Card
32GB PALIT GEFORCE RTX 5090 GAMEROCK - HDMI, 3 x DP
1st M.2 SSD Drive
1TB CRUCIAL T500 GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 7300MB/sR, 6800MB/sW)
1st M.2 SSD Drive
2TB CORSAIR CORE XT MP600 NVMe PCIe M.2 SSD (up to 5000 MB/R, 4400 MB/W)
Power Supply
CORSAIR 1000W RMx SERIES™ ATX 3.1, MODULAR, CYBENETICS GOLD
Power Cable
1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead, 1.0mm Core)
Processor Cooling
CORSAIR NAUTILUS 360 RS ARGB HIGH PERFORMANCE CPU COOLER
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
ONBOARD 2.5Gbe LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
NONE OR ONBOARD Wi-Fi (MOTHERBOARD DEPENDENT)
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Windows Recovery Media
Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)
Anti-Virus
NO ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE
Browser
Microsoft® Edge
Warranty
3 Year Platinum Warranty (3 Year Collect & Return, 3 Year Parts, 3 Year labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 6 to 8 working days
Price: £4,256.00 including VAT and Delivery
Unique URL to re-configure: https://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/saved-configurations/amd-am5-pc/54h3udP2pp/

 

[Clintster]

The AIO coolers are not water, they're a non-conductive liquid. Unfortunately none of the PCS-branded air-coolers are worthwhile (and their liquid coolers are worse - as more to go wrong). But for that level of CPU, you'll need a liquid cooler anyway (or a very good air-cooler sourced elsewhere).

For a non-blingy case (although you can turn off the RGB anyway), you've got the Fractal Define 7 or its big brother the Fractal Define 7 XL (which is popular for quiet builds in the creative industry)...

PCSpecialist - FRACTAL DEFINE 7 BLACK QUIET MID-TOWER CASE

PCSpecialist - FRACTAL DEFINE 7 XL BLACK QUIET TOWER CASE

...or the Fractal North...which has better airflow and non-RGB fans on the front...

PCSpecialist - FRACTAL NORTH TG XL GAMING CASE (BLACK)

Brilliant Tony, Thank you so much for your advice

 

[Clintster]

So.... here is the ultimate build. It's the best, simple as that. There isn't a better option for any use outside of a proper workstation (threadripper).

Case
FRACTAL NORTH TG XL GAMING CASE (BLACK)
Processor (CPU)
AMD Ryzen 9 9950X 16 Core CPU (4.3GHz-5.7GHz/80MB CACHE/AM5)
Motherboard
GIGABYTE X870E AORUS ELITE WIFI7 (AM5, DDR5, M.2 PCIe 5.0, Wi-Fi 7)
Memory (RAM)
96GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR5 5200MHz CL38 (2 x 48GB) KIT
Graphics Card
32GB PALIT GEFORCE RTX 5090 GAMEROCK - HDMI, 3 x DP
1st M.2 SSD Drive
1TB CRUCIAL T500 GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 7300MB/sR, 6800MB/sW)
1st M.2 SSD Drive
2TB CORSAIR CORE XT MP600 NVMe PCIe M.2 SSD (up to 5000 MB/R, 4400 MB/W)
Power Supply
CORSAIR 1000W RMx SERIES™ ATX 3.1, MODULAR, CYBENETICS GOLD
Power Cable
1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead, 1.0mm Core)
Processor Cooling
CORSAIR NAUTILUS 360 RS ARGB HIGH PERFORMANCE CPU COOLER
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
ONBOARD 2.5Gbe LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
NONE OR ONBOARD Wi-Fi (MOTHERBOARD DEPENDENT)
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Windows Recovery Media
Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)
Anti-Virus
NO ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE
Browser
Microsoft® Edge
Warranty
3 Year Platinum Warranty (3 Year Collect & Return, 3 Year Parts, 3 Year labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 6 to 8 working days
Price: £4,256.00 including VAT and Delivery
Unique URL to re-configure: https://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/saved-configurations/amd-am5-pc/54h3udP2pp/

That is Fantastic, I didn't realise that about the memory so there's little point in maxing it out with 4 slots. I think I'll probably go with your selection, It's a little over my budget but then I'm too old to ever be doing it again. Thank you for taking the time with me to produce this. It is much appreciated.

 

[Scott]

That is Fantastic, I didn't realise that about the memory so there's little point in maxing it out with 4 slots. I think I'll probably go with your selection, It's a little over my budget but then I'm too old to ever be doing it again. Thank you for taking the time with me to produce this. It is much appreciated.

Yes, this is the thing. At first glance it seems that maxing it out will cover any use case but there are always trade offs to consider. This goes for all aspects. More often than not the trade off is how much it costs vs how much performance you get, but in this case there is a trade off to performance that saves you cash so it's more worthwhile. There are situations where more RAM would work better, this isn't one of them.... and where it is you would want to up to a Threadripper anyway.

No worries at all.

As an a-side. I'm not sure if you have ever used remote desktop. Certainly when it comes to non-gaming use, remote control of the computer from a laptop gives you the best of both worlds. You can have your desktop virtually anywhere and connect via the laptop. You can then harness the power of the desktop and remotely queue tasks etc on the desktop.

I've worked this way for years now. It's rare that I actually use the desktop directly.

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

And just to clarify my perspective with the DGX Spark, the GUI would be whatever windows device you’re running the operations from, the Spark merely runs as the AI processor, you’d never need to touch it, you’d never need to access it, it simply sits on your network and the AI processes you run on your laptop are offloaded to the spark. But the Spark does have a GUI as well as any OS does, it’s simply Linux based. In exactly the same way as if you were running a transaction through a web based AI, the actual AI processing is done on the server over the internet.

Most modern computing is done with server nodes offloading processes, NAS drives for instance are simply mini file servers and a lot more these days.

 

[Clintster]

And just to clarify my perspective with the DGX Spark, the GUI would be whatever windows device you’re running the operations from, the Spark merely runs as the AI processor, you’d never need to touch it, you’d never need to access it, it simply sits on your network and the AI processes you run on your laptop are offloaded to the spark. But the Spark does have a GUI as well as any OS does, it’s simply Linux based. In exactly the same way as if you were running a transaction through a web based AI, the actual AI processing is done on the server over the internet.

Most modern computing is done with server nodes offloading processes, NAS drives for instance are simply mini file servers and a lot more these days.

Thanks for the explanation.

 

[Clintster]

Yes, this is the thing. At first glance it seems that maxing it out will cover any use case but there are always trade offs to consider. This goes for all aspects. More often than not the trade off is how much it costs vs how much performance you get, but in this case there is a trade off to performance that saves you cash so it's more worthwhile. There are situations where more RAM would work better, this isn't one of them.... and where it is you would want to up to a Threadripper anyway.

No worries at all.

As an a-side. I'm not sure if you have ever used remote desktop. Certainly when it comes to non-gaming use, remote control of the computer from a laptop gives you the best of both worlds. You can have your desktop virtually anywhere and connect via the laptop. You can then harness the power of the desktop and remotely queue tasks etc on the desktop.

I've worked this way for years now. It's rare that I actually use the desktop directly.

I didn't realise that was possible with an ordinary laptop, I though you had to get a dumb terminal or something.

 

[Scott]

I didn't realise that was possible with an ordinary laptop, I though you had to get a dumb terminal or something.

Yeah, there are many options. Remote desktop is the built in option. I use Moonlight and Sunshine (Sunshine is the server, moonlight is the client). The remote desktop limits some resources such as the GPU which Moonlight doesn't so it's better for my uses.

 

[Clintster]

Yeah, there are many options. Remote desktop is the built in option. I use Moonlight and Sunshine (Sunshine is the server, moonlight is the client). The remote desktop limits some resources such as the GPU which Moonlight doesn't so it's better for my uses.

Great, many thanks Scott