New PC well under performing!!

[SlimCini]

Thanks for the feedback and advice, yes getting better advice or more likely buying local is the future.
I still disagree, as per my original post, that the spec of a PC 8 years later is no better, surely we have moved on! I picked the Home Office system, and only changed from Intel to AMD.

Anyway, I will check with PCS re system check and reinstall, as it will likely need returned and tweaked by them to retain warranty, won't it?

Do i really need SSD & graphics card for word docs and internet browsing?

Graphics card - definitely not.

SSD will speed up the loading of anything you have to do... so turning it on (and off), loading up Word etc. All will be significantly faster if installed on an SSD instead of a cheap mechanical hard drive. SSDs are more expensive for a reason... they're better. You just need to decide how much you need one. I'd say a CPU upgrade is more vital, but an SSD would come after that if pure speed of software is what you're after.

 

[ubuysa]

For Word docs and Internet browsing an SSD is a luxury. Yes it will make a difference to system start up, program startup and file reading and writing, whether your usage and/or need for that speed is justified by the cost is up to you.

 

[smurph]

Thanks, I think i read you right, but that leaves me more confused, why do PCS create user PCs, that don't suit normal users???

Do i really need SSD & graphics card for word docs and internet browsing?

 

[mantadog]

Thanks, I think i read you right, but that leaves me more confused, why do PCS create user PCs, that don't suit normal users???

PCS supply a custom build service and will put whatever you want in the system, assuming compatibility is ok. You could put an AMD APU in a system with a top tier AMD GPU, for 99% of people it would make no sense because the CPU would bottleneck the GPU horribly, but for a while a few years back it could have had a legitimate use as a bitcoin mining rig. PCS (along with most other custom builders) assume a certain level of competence. If you don't have it then its not something you can really guess at without some knowledge. I spent most of my early years on these forums advising people in the "check this spec" forum subsections because I felt it was better than going to a high street retailer and being flogged a machine with loads of bloatware on it.

The system you build will have a use to someone, PCS juts didn't know it was of no use to you as they built it.

 

[smurph]

Fair enough I have learnt a lot through this process and forum, and for that I do thank you all.
But again that answer is poor....I still point out I ordered an office PC, what i was sold doesn't really do the job at all, so they shouldn't sell it as that with that spec.
The main point is the PC is far from acceptable for even the most mundane of office jobs.
So in essence, joe public shouldn't buy from PCS. So why do they advertise like mad to get trade from such?

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

Fair enough I have learnt a lot through this process and forum, and for that I do thank you all.
But again that answer is poor....I still point out I ordered an office PC, what i was sold doesn't really do the job at all, so they shouldn't sell it as that with that spec.
The main point is the PC is far from acceptable for even the most mundane of office jobs.
So in essence, joe public shouldn't buy from PCS. So why do they advertise like mad to get trade from such?

Anyone ordering a custom PC is expected to have some knowledge, or seek help when ordering a system. Custom pc's and laptops take maintenance in a way off the shelf computers may not. You need to know about driver installations and updates as well as components.

These forums and many others thrive by knowledgeable people helping out newbies to get them the system they want.

I'd say always buy custom as you get more for your money over a prebuilt system. BUT don't expect to get what you're after without help if you don't know about the hardware.

 

[SlimCini]

Fair enough I have learnt a lot through this process and forum, and for that I do thank you all.
But again that answer is poor....I still point out I ordered an office PC, what i was sold doesn't really do the job at all, so they shouldn't sell it as that with that spec.
The main point is the PC is far from acceptable for even the most mundane of office jobs.
So in essence, joe public shouldn't buy from PCS. So why do they advertise like mad to get trade from such?

When you say you ordered an 'office pc' and they shouldn't sell it as 'that', do you just mean you ordered from the sub-section titled HOME/OFFICE COMPUTERS? And saying they shouldn't sell it as 'that' with 'that spec'... you're the one who chose that spec! Choosing to buy from a customisable PC seller places a certain responsibility on yourself to know what to choose. If you're just going to buy the cheapest components in the dropdown mensu in the home/office section because you don't know what any of them do and expect the finished machine to perform wonders, then your best bet would have been to go to PC World.

I'd say the majority of Joe public who navigate to custom PC sellers and choosing to spend a few hundred of pounds on something would probably do a bit of research about components before they do so. I wouldn't buy anything over even £50 without researching about it and what I would expect from it and whether I could get it cheaper elsewhere. I certainly wouldn't look at a sub-section banner of a website and use that as a guide as to what to expect. A 'HOME/OFFICE PC' is a pretty generic (well known I'd say) PC term to describe about the most basic computer you can get. I don't think you can realistically expect any PC in that sub-section to be able to do anything that any home or office in the country could potentially do.

So in essence, Joe Public should certainly buy from customisable PC sellers like PCS, provided they have a semblance of knowledge about PC components, or alternatively take the time to ask for advice about them from people who do.

 

[smurph]

I agree and understand most of what you say, and now know I have made an error in this purchase, or there are underlying issues with its setup - something still unresolved.
But you're not grasping the fact that 8 years on a similar level PC is same or worse performance, this should NOT be, no matter what I know/research!
I do not expect wonders I expect it to work reasonably, what I have struggles out of the box, this should also not be the case.
The end.

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

I agree and understand most of what you say, and now know I have made an error in this purchase, or there are underlying issues with its setup - something still unresolved.
But you're not grasping the fact that 8 years on a similar level PC is same or worse performance, this should NOT be, no matter what I know/research!
I do not expect wonders I expect it to work reasonably, what I have struggles out of the box, this should also not be the case.
The end.

You're not grasping that your old system, no matter how old was of a much higher spec than the one you've just bought. What you have bought is designed for a Linux installation or core server for home office usage.

The simple fact is it is not designed for the usage you're expecting, it's underpowered. What you've said is essentially the same as saying a 68 mustang overpowers a 2016 golf. There's no comparison.

There are tiers to computer hardware, from atom based processors intended for low power tablets, celerons which are simply cheap and poor performers, through to core i3 for entry level, i5 for mid, i7 for high end home, xeon's for data processing and scientific etc etc. Each one has a designed and intended usage. What you chose did not fit your usage and if you'd asked for help everyone would have told you the same thing.

You've just gone for the cheapest possible build hoping for miracles.

 

[SlimCini]

But you're not grasping the fact that 8 years on a similar level PC is same or worse performance, this should NOT be

Repeating that this "shouldn't be" isn't going to change the fact that it CAN be... we've told you that several times now.

 

[smurph]

You're right, it's a way below par PC that they shouldn't (be allowed) to sell, but they CAN.

 

[BlessedSquirrel]

You're right, it's a way below par PC that they shouldn't (be allowed) to sell, but they CAN.

I disagree, for its intended uses of a core server or nas server, it's perfectly powered and should definitely be on sale.

 

[SlimCini]

You're right, it's a way below par PC that they shouldn't (be allowed) to sell, but they CAN.

What are you attempting to achieve by posting all this? PCS have explained to you why the PC you bought is subjectively 'slow'. We've explained to why it's subjectively 'slow'. There's no grey area... it's fact that it's slow because you chose cheaper components that made it slow. You made the error of not doing your research. You expected too much of the components you bought and now you seem to be blaming PCS simply because they label a sub-section of their website as 'HOME/OFFICE COMPUTERS'. And that's just bad form in my opinion.

Do you blame Amazon if you buy a movie in the 'thriller' section that you don't find thrilling?

 

[Oussebon]

To turn back to the OP's question about upgrading parts:

This is a list of the CPUs(APUs) that your motherboard supports: https://www.asus.com/uk/Motherboards/AM1MA/HelpDesk_CPU/
So the AMD Athlon-5350 is your best option for that mobo.
This benchmark gives you a rough idea of what kind of extra performance you get: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1226?vs=1223 So it would perform quite significantly better.
In in your shoes I would at least upgrade that. It's also a relatively inexpensive part to upgrade in of itself, as I can tell

A good SSD like the Samsung will be a lot better than your HDD, in terms of loading your OS and programs faster. But it's not a 'budget' part and so will make up a decent chunk of that ~£200 quote.

If you're not gaming, the benefit of a GPU like the 750 ti will be more limited. If you are gaming then it's a good entry-level card. Decent GPUs aren't super cheap. A GTX 750 might generally set one back ~£100, maybe less maybe more depending on the exact model and the vendor.

But I'm not sure if the OP has told us what hardware exactly was in their old machine? I scanned the forum thread but didn't see it.
This is a higher end general desktop intel CPU from about 2007 vs the Athlon 5350: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/59?vs=1223
As you can see, one would still usually be better off with that intel.
So while upgrading the CPU should certainly be expected make this PC run better than it currently does, the OP may not find it to perform meaningfully better than their old machine. It depends what the old one was.

I would also say to the OP - while acknowledging that this brings little comfort - that it is sadly quite easy to buy something in terms of electronics that doesn't perform as one might expect without it at all having being mis-sold.

There is a large PC retailer that has a store near my home. I've bought a lot of stuff there personally (not PCs, mostly accessories), but I have browsed the PCs they have on offer. Many of them are actually quite odd builds, things like high end i7 CPUs with low end GPUs. Or maybe a low end AMD CPU and a mid/high end graphics card. But then you walk down the aisle a bit and there'll be a PC with a decent i5 CPU and a decent graphics card for the same or better price. But then, while that's best for the gamer, the i7 with the rubbish GPU would probably be better for someone using Adobe Elements as a main hobby, or for home business use with multiple monitors. All of these are perfectly reasonable PCs one might have in one's home, but it depends a lot of what one needs it for, and whether there is a baseline from which one is upgrading.

Or people who buy laptops for gaming, not because they actually need the portability, but because laptops are what they've used all their lives and they just don't know that desktops for gaming are better value for money. But if you go into a shop and ask for a gaming laptop, they'll probably just show you the gaming laptop selection. My partner was a laptop fan, but having got a gaming desktop I don't think they'd go back to laptops for gaming.

My point is that it's very easy to buy something that isn't best value for a given purpose in the tech, whether shopping online or in store. Not because the builds are necessarily illegitimate, but because there are so, so many options.

As I say, that's no real comfort to someone who is disappointed in a purchase. All I'm saying is that it's fairly easy to get something that isn't the best for what one wants.

 

[ubuysa]

Thanks, I think i read you right, but that leaves me more confused, why do PCS create user PCs, that don't suit normal users???

Simple answer; because PCS don't build computers for "normal users". The overwhelming majority of PCS's customers are gamers and/or knowledgeable high-end computer users. PCS are not really in the business of supplying "normal users".

But again that answer is poor....I still point out I ordered an office PC, what i was sold doesn't really do the job at all, so they shouldn't sell it as that with that spec.

Again. PCS supply people who understand what technology they want and need. For those who are less technically savvy you'll get masses of very competent help on these fora. Most people unsure of what they need post their chosen spec on here and ask for help.

I have to agree with those who take issue with your claim that a modern PC "must" outperform a 8-year old PC. That's just not true, it's all down to the spec.

I'm sorry you're disappointed, had you asked for advice on the spec on here you'd have been guided in the right direction for your budget and expected usage.

Caveat emptor.

 

[smurph]

OK, I do get it, just frustrated it has happened to me (on behalf of my father).
Thanks Oussebon.
I will likely go for this upgrade of CPU & SSD.
Just not convinced re the graphics card, as there is to be no gaming (its my dads PC), so likely not, anyone any other thoughts?

Can someone spec an office PC that would do my job, compared to what I had/have and understanding my simple use, all as described in this thread???

 

[SlimCini]

Budget?

 

[smurph]

Ye, a budget pc! I'm hoping £500-600. Is there a market-place i can sell this rig on?

 

[Oussebon]

Maybe something like this:
(remember to get rid of the free trials if you don't need them and don't want 'bloatware' on your pristine new PC)

- i5 6600 is one of the best CPUs going.
- 8gb RAM should be more than enough.
- The case and cooler are decent quality, and should keep temps and noise to an appropriate level.
- Samsung Evo SSDs are very good. If you want to go up to £602 you could double the size to 250gb, though if your dad doesn't game or video edit he probably doesn't need the capacity. That said, the 250gb ones are actually even faster than the 120gb ones, they're not just bigger.

CPUs (i5 6600 vs that Semperon): http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1646?vs=1226
SSD (size and speed): http://www.anandtech.com/show/8747/samsung-ssd-850-evo-review/8

As for selling the old one off, no idea, maybe put an ad in the local paper or one of the many websites that do classified ads. Beware when selling online. There are ways to use mechanisms that exist to protect buyers that can be used to exploit sellers (there are claims that this happens with some paypal and ebay transactions). Obviously most sales happen fine, but just make sure to be aware of the issues.

Case
InWIN 503 MID TOWER GAMING CASE (WHITE)
Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™i5 Quad Core Processor i5-6600 (3.3GHz) 6MB Cache
Motherboard
ASUS® H110M-D D3: Micro-ATX, LG1151, USB 3.0, SATA 6GBs
Memory (RAM)
8GB Kingston DUAL-DDR3 1600MHz (1 x 8GB)
Graphics Card
INTEGRATED GRAPHICS ACCELERATOR (GPU)
1st Hard Disk
120GB Samsung 850 EVO 2.5" SSD, SATA 6Gb/s (upto 540MB/sR | 520MB/sW)
2nd Hard Disk
1TB SATA-III 3.5" HDD, 6GB/s, 7200RPM, 32MB CACHE
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Power Supply
CORSAIR 350W VS SERIES™ VS-350 POWER SUPPLY
Processor Cooling
Super Quiet Titan DragonFly Heatpipe Intel CPU Cooler (£19)
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Wireless/Wired Networking
10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT (Wi-Fi NOT INCLUDED)
USB Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Power Cable
1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)
Operating System
Genuine Windows 10 Home 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft® Office® 365
Anti-Virus
BullGuard™ Internet Security - Free 90 Day License inc. Gamer Mode
Warranty
3 Year Silver Warranty (1 Year Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour) (£5)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 6 to 8 working days
Quantity
1
Price: £588.00 including VAT and delivery.
Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/intel-skylake-home-office-pc/W3k2xxA8IB/

 

[mantadog]

This should do a better job and is much cheaper than the above which as many OTT specs for your uses.


Case
COOLERMASTER ELITE 311 BLUE CASE
Processor (CPU)
Intel® Pentium® Dual-Core G4500 (3.50GHz, 3MB Cache) + HD Graphics more than fast enough for your needs, about 5 times faster than the Sempron listed on page 1. The i5 listed above is way overkill
Motherboard
ASUS® H110M-D D3: Micro-ATX, LG1151, USB 3.0, SATA 6GBs
Memory (RAM)
4GB Kingston DUAL-DDR3 1600MHz (1 x 4GB) should be plenty, I do more demanding stuff than you and manage fine on 4GB
Graphics Card
INTEGRATED GRAPHICS ACCELERATOR (GPU)
1st Hard Disk
1TB WD BLACK 3.5" WD1003FZEX, SATA 6 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE (7200rpm) didn't go for the SSD, went for the performance HDD instead. Used the caviar black for yoears myself brilliant drive.
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Power Supply
CORSAIR 350W VS SERIES™ VS-350 POWER SUPPLY
Processor Cooling
INTEL STANDARD CPU COOLER
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Wireless/Wired Networking
10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT (Wi-Fi NOT INCLUDED)
USB Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Power Cable
1 x 1 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)
Operating System
Genuine Windows 10 Home 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft® Office® 365
Anti-Virus
BullGuard™ Internet Security - Free 90 Day License inc. Gamer Mode
Warranty
3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 6 to 8 working days
Quantity
1

Price: £390.00 including VAT and delivery.

Unique URL to re-configure: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/quotes/intel-skylake-home-office-pc/sK3NkGC0vB/

All in £390, so abut £100 more trhan your original setup but will feel seamless to use.